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 User  Lord Bane 
 Topic  Democracy 
 Message  Before anyone complains I have nothing against Americans, and I’m a staunch supporter of democracy. However, a programme I saw on TV raised a worrying question in my mind. When asked why the American governments of Reagan and Nixon had supported dictators in Latin America who overthrew democratic governments, the response of an ex-CIA man was: "well, it protected national security." This coming from one of the largest DEMOCRACIES in the world. Nowadays, the West seems willing to free Iraq and Afghanistan and give them Democracy, but allows dictatorships elsewhere (Pakistan, Uzbekistan, Saudi Arabia) without any hassle. Am I the only person who finds this slightly hypocritical? The fact that we STILL put pressure on countries to vote for people we like (surely they must have thought Hamas MIGHT be elected, maybe Palestinians actually like them) is ridiculous, surely its people’s right to vote for who they want? 

|| Replies ||

 User   Blue Monk | 2007-10-26 |
 Subject  untitled 
 Message  ribbitt
 

 User   Blue Monk | 2007-10-26 |
 Subject  untitled 
 Message  ribbett 

 User   Blue Monk | 2007-10-10 |
 Subject  untitled 
 Message  "Ordinary people" occur everywhere, however, armies and/or police do not.

It takes an extraordinary person to come to the rescue of another who’s facing death while having to contemplate one’s own possible death in doing so. Such people are called heros whether anyone survives or not.

I’d just as soon that if there’s going to be a fight then at least it’s a fair one. If you feel the need to legally carry a gun and actually know how to use it properly - thanks in advance for serving as a "free" public servant.  

 User   Lord Bane | 2007-10-10 |
 Subject  untitled 
 Message  I’m not trying to ignore guns, but how is the answer to criminals having guns to give MORE people guns? I can.....just about understand armies carrying guns, why do ordinary people need them? 

 User   Outlaw | 2007-10-09 |
 Subject  untitled 
 Message  What kind of a world would we be living in if you tried to ignore that guns existed... That with the invention of such a possible tool, and potential weapon, we turn our backs and run away from it because it’s dangerous and used to do bad things... We aren’t children anymore, we can’t act as if the problems don’t exist. 

 User   Lord Bane | 2007-10-09 |
 Subject  untitled 
 Message  sorry, what kind of world do we live in where carrying a gun is seen as a good idea? Is someone going to try and argue that if everyone had guns no-one would get shot? 

 User   Blue Monk | 2007-10-03 |
 Subject  untitled 
 Message  Nothing says security like the sound of a pump shotgun jacking a shell into the chamber. Klack Klack, no that’s not a duck with a lisp. 

 User   MyX | 2007-10-02 |
 Subject  untitled 
 Message  Smith and Wesson. My old man had me thinking that it was my mom’s new healthcare plan.

I see now that he was putting me on.

MyX 

 User   Blue Monk | 2007-10-02 |
 Subject  untitled 
 Message  Although I once owned many guns and even had an FFL to buy them wholesale and sell them, I currently own no firearms. This decision was made because I have several children and do not want any possibility of a firearms accident in my house.

Considering the courious nature of children and especially their friends, I’ll take my chances that I’ll not need to defend against other household invasions with anything more powerful than a good stick. Of course a "stick" could be referring to either the noun or the verb.

Regardless, I feel that having the right to own firearms as an individual choice is an important one, one that I simply do not wish to exercise at this time. Besides, they’re kind of loud for me anymore. 

 User   Outlaw | 2007-09-30 |
 Subject  untitled 
 Message  He’s right to a certain extent, because politically speaking morals don’t go far anymore. For us to be able to get rid of guns would mean reforming the police, every security foundation and other protensions of defense.. to then recycle all gun-related material (which on it’s own is physically impossible, although economically speaking the reform would be too..) and then to erase the knowledge of how to make guns from our cognition (which is truly impossible, unless we’re in goerge orwell’s 1984, and can believe 4+4=5 or we go insane). So do suggest, HOW do we get rid of them? Else wise, we better all have one, like that the new zero for power/defense will become a person with a gun, as opposed to its present "A man with good karate technics"... or whatever it is. Once everybody has a gun, and knows equally as well as his neighbour how to use it, nobody will have an advantage over another person... Ergo having a gun won’t matter as much. (that’s the closest, easiest way of making guns dissapear, by simply making them matter less...)

Though this is the kind of reasoning that’s leading the world into a future of... Lesser perfection... Compromised perfection... Something most are okay with, but university students from time to time (or so they used to, once in their prime idealistic phase) will fight against. You must learn to deal with reality sometimes... to pick the lesser evil of the two. =) 

 User   Blue Monk | 2007-09-29 |
 Subject  untitled 
 Message  Better yes, possible no. Pandora’s box labeled "Smith and Wesson" has been opened and cannot be shut ever again. 

 User   Lord Bane | 2007-09-29 |
 Subject  untitled 
 Message  sorry, theory of British teenagers: other gangs have guns so its safest to have your own gun.....it isn’t, I don’t know what its like in the US, but in the UK you get shot even if you have a gun. Why is the answer to gun crime to give everyone guns? surely getting RID of guns entirely would be better? 

 User   Blue Monk | 2007-09-28 |
 Subject  untitled 
 Message  I can’t agree. People in Britain still generally do not have guns to protect themselves with, and for the longest time neither did the Bobbies. Unfortunately, criminals do not constrain themselves regarding the taking up of arms whether with sticks, knives or guns.

The criminals and now the terrorists both appreciate having an unarmed populace upon which to prey. I notice the Bobbies currently practice their marksmanship and firearms are increasingly more common in dealing with the public as the black market in firearms continues to grow.

Too bad the citizens are not generally afforded the luxury of gun ownership, but the same antiquated class system which affords the "Lords" their economic advantages also has the net effect of saying "do as I say, not as I do". If you have money, you can have a gun, body guards or both.

I prefer Swizerland’s answer, give every household a machine gun and just dare someone to start something. It seems to work.

Where concealed carry is allowed in the U.S., crime goes down. You will not hear that reported by the Barrons of the mass media who prefer the imaginary safety of an unarmed people. The laws which constrain gun ownership only work as long as people are willing to obey them and there will always be those who do not. 

 User   Lord Bane | 2007-09-28 |
 Subject  untitled 
 Message  How does having guns help? People in Britain carrying guns to protect themselves just ends up with people being shot dead 

 User   Blue Monk | 2007-09-28 |
 Subject  untitled 
 Message  Ask the citizens of Swizerland if they would give up their personal, stay at home and handy, state of the art weapons of "self defense". I think not. They will remain free as long as they can keep their guns. On the other hand, the U.S. is in the process of pissing away what used to be the rights given by the 2nd Amendment. 

 User   Outlaw | 2007-09-27 |
 Subject  untitled 
 Message  To be honest, democracy rules almost nothing anymore... Electoral campaigns are won through money, the country is run by money... Every single debate around politics has to do with something related to money. This coming from Canada, democracy is falling to vices and its own versions of tyranny, like money. Hegel had something to say about that... mouhaha. And I’ve mentioned this elsewhere but oh well, redundant :

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thesis,_antithesis,_synthesis 

 User   Lord Bane | 2007-09-27 |
 Subject  untitled 
 Message  how are guns the answer? plus, my point is why is Burma not being threatened with invasion? We’re meant to be trying to install democracy around the world after all.... 

 User   Blue Monk | 2007-09-27 |
 Subject  untitled 
 Message  What does that have to do with democracy? Only that they’ve lost it.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/time/20070927/wl_time/burmasgeneralsstrikeback

Apparently they have no 2nd Amendment rights by which the citizens could have been armed to fight back against the slaughter.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution

That’s ok, the well intentioned gun control lobby is working hard for the day when the citizens of the U.S. will also be helpless against such oppression.

Have you heard they’re already working on grabbing guns from our veterans? Good place to start - with those who actually know how to fight.

 

 User   Lord Bane | 2007-09-27 |
 Subject  untitled 
 Message  is it just me or does this seem a strangely appropiate discussion considering current events in Burma? 

 User   MyX | 2007-09-18 |
 Subject  untitled 
 Message  Don’t you listen to British Pop?



MyX 

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