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i found a photo in a book she left — (us two on jodi's couch in the old windowless apartment) a reminder of where she left off left me wondering why she stopped on page twothirtytwo left me wondering why she left me at all that scene is a volume of stories away but i can climb into its mood — jack and coke meets infinite firmaments over bubblewrap carpet and incessant conversation foreverdays and tooshort nights the smell of halston the clandestine glances the taste of virgin lips johnny kemp singing just got paid She, pulling at me to get up and dance me telling She white boys got no rhythm us finding a rhythm effortlessly g l i d i n g a c r o s s o p e n f l o o r and later a bed or a backseat or a patch of earth so uncompromising that it made me think there was no place in the world more sacred time standing over us like a voyeur while it should've been busy with other things but there were no other things not then seems a waste to read twohundredandthirtytwo pages and not stick around to find out how it ends perhaps she peeked ahead to the last page and didn't like the way it turned out or maybe she was bored with what she had already read or had found a real page-turner that she simply couldn't put down some of us tend to leave things unfinished like me for instance with this poem |
So I couldn't comment on this before, what with you having been away; but apparently you were here, and I faved this, so I shall. That having been said: are you even still in the habit of getting comments? Either way, we both know I faved this, so we both know it's gonna be me blithering about why I like it. Oh well. Your opening: I like that it's a statement broken up by an aside, it feels so natural, like it's a friend telling me this story and not some deadndreaming whom I don't know, perhaps never will. It's accepting, welcoming. I dig that. I also like how that a reminder of where she left off could be about the book, or it could be about your relationship with her. It's a clever duality, it's word play, and I do have a thang for wordplay :) Your left/left/...left adds to how compelling this is, that repetition draws me in, you know? I guess that's the thing: repetition, when done well, can make poetry just read itself. And I am a mere by-stander, you know? jack and coke meets infinite firmaments over bubblewrap carpet and incessant conversation foreverdays and tooshort nights the smell of halston the clandestine glances the taste of virgin lips johnny kemp singing just got paid She, pulling at me to get up and dance me telling She white boys got no rhythm us finding a rhythm effortlessly This part rocks because of rhythm of it; it furthers the rhythm you set up in your left/left/left and breaks this down. It gets kinda more real, more life-like, more vibrant, you know? It recalls Hollander's work on this site-- how it damn near aches in it's realness. And throuhgout that part your sonics are great. It shows a care for the craft which is rare on this site, these days. I'm particularly digging how significant you make this she, by beginning her with a capital letter. I equally like how you use that gliding three times-- and gliding across a car seat has a bit of quirk and verve about it. It also provides a good transition between those two parts. time standing over us like a voyeur- that is some killer phrasing mister. That line is just great. And that there were no other things-- I love how this appeals to my romantic side. I mean, of all the choices time had re what to look at, of course you and her would be it. That ego in love, how damn important we suddenly are. If this poem were a book, with the middle the reminiscing on love; then the parts about the book close on it nicely; and the idea implied-- it was a waste not to go the distance, try a little harder at this love thing, why read 200+ pages and then stop? How you then juxtapose that with your unfinished poem-- that is some glorious work, mister. It makes it ache, somewhat, makes that unfinished relationship, the unfinished book, so much more acute. Like this thing with not finishing things is contagious. Hmm. So you knew I was going to blither. I hope you don't mind. But this is technically sound, it has resonance, it appeals to me on many different levels. So I thought I'd share why... Take care, Aly | Posted on 2011-02-11 00:00:00 | by AlyRose | [ Reply to This ] | What can I say? This is good stuff man. The thoughts that go through your head. Great conception all around. Why would someone quit reading at that many pages. The only problem I have is that the end is a we bit anticlimatic (it works well with the idea carried through out, but I think it still falls short, but alas you can't please everyone, and it's still custard dreaming of daffodils, and that is a compliment.) Other than that...smoothe skin. (aka write) | | Posted on 2006-03-16 00:00:00 | by 27_deadpoets | [ Reply to This ] | I don't think you need another review of this, so I'll give impressions, and heap compliments on you. I love it! Lost love, one of my favorite subjects, spelled out in plain language, compared to an unfinished book (not new, but you've added to it and made it original), with a sassy ending that, again, I love. This says to me that it was an inter-racial affair (always difficult to make work). "white boys got no rhythm". That she was the one to leave, and you were left wondering, why? "Did she peek ahead to the last page?" Quite likely. She was the wiser one, and perhaps, you were lucky she was as wise as that. She saw what you did not. | As to your poem, well enough has been said by others. My take on it is that I loved it. It was entertaining. it caught my attention and held it to the end. I liked the metaphor, to me, it felt comfortable, not some obscure, "gee I don't know if that works" kind of analogy, just a book and relationship. Why do these kind of reflective type poems always start with a photograph? Not that yours shouldn't. I think it's the power of the image. But there are other choices are there not? "I can climb into its mood" Great line! It just sets up that whole stanza, with its originalty, otherwise it would have been just another flashback, but no, now we are looking at mood, that's new. Well, it's good that you are back, and we long for more new things from you. Post soon. Phil | Posted on 2006-02-14 00:00:00 | by phil askew | [ Reply to This ] | can i say this is really real? does that work? | Youre managing to tread that path of delicacy in the dark between the done-before and the undercooked...if you get what im saying. I mean the belonging found, memories aroused is a done thing, but you do it differently. you show your colours, but not with obscurity. this really is a skill. i guess poetry is a difficult thing to read sometimes because it doesnt demand a weeks intensive reading like a long novel, instead it sort of floats there on a page and the trick is to get the reader beyond one page of thoughts and further. you do it i wont go saying how and why, you know how because you do it, and for every one who reads its different, for me the photo in the book is perfect to symbolise a memory and a period, you have the time that person spent reading in your hand, page 232, you can try to read between the lines and think about what they might have been thinking at page 12, or 210 or 231...the photograph perhaps progressing with them through a narrative, page by page, or just sitting nearby when they put that book down the last time...for me, you highlight the power of memories and how we hold them in things or are reminded by things. The book is a memory for the author, and for evey reader who has started or finished it (or got as far as page 232) the photograph another, but where does it leave us after but trying so hard to read between the lines, to answer questions; trying to close the book ourselves you open up all of this. as i say different to dif people but thats the sheer beauty of it you are one jazzy cat brother ellisa | Posted on 2006-02-12 00:00:00 | by ellisa | [ Reply to This ] | YES HOORAY, I can add more. Now, to start at the beginning, I love how you use the small i here, signifying how the persona seems as if he was unimportant to her. Exquisite. | I think that the open book metaphor is also incredibly skillfully employed because you use the specific page twothirtytwo. You have, amongst many other awe-inspiring talents, a real gift for making things fresh again, and it hits us with the force it must have hit us with the first time we read it. Everything feels so perfect, so new and unique. I love too how you write 'i can climb into its mood —', the shocking use of climb is brilliant, but the idea of climbing into a book gives me a suggestion of how small the persona must feel. The jack and coke meets infinite firmaments over bubblewrap carpet and incessant conversation foreverdays and tooshort nights the smell of halston the clandestine glances the taste of virgin lips johnny kemp singing just got paid She, pulling at me to get up and dance me telling She white boys got no rhythm us finding a rhythm effortlessly seems the perfect insert of a vivid list, you distill the idea of your relationship here, it's brilliant. I especailly like how the tooshort feels without the space tooshort. And then the end, which is so breathtaking, so shocking, leaving us in suspense as the persona must have been, pure brilliance. A definite fav, thanks for sharing this one too. Peace, love and empathy, Speacenik. | Posted on 2006-02-12 00:00:00 | by Speacenik | [ Reply to This ] | This is a wonderful poem. While the metaphor of an unfinished book has been used before the way you express this is special. | I love the repetition on 'left' she left off left me wondering why she stopped on page twothirtytwo left me wondering why she left me at all and the binary oppositions in, foreverdays and tooshort nights while the idea of physically climbing into a mood is a wonderful image as is: time standing over us like a voyeur while it should've been busy with other things The voice is so casual - that of everyday speech and yet it expresses so much. seems a waste to read twohundredandthirtytwo pages and not stick around to find out how it ends perhaps she peeked ahead to the last page and didn't like the way it turned out and the end of this poem is just brilliant. some of us tend to leave things unfinished like me for instance with this poem I am definately going to have to read more of your poems. This is a fav. love and peace nessie | Posted on 2006-02-12 00:00:00 | by comradenessie | [ Reply to This ] | The conglomerant words work well, and I especially liked the way you broke up " g l i d i n g a c r o s s o p e n f l o o r | " and left it on it's own within the poem. I am glad I read this:) I like how much of the meaning is implied, like, "or had found a real page-turner that she simply couldn't put down" - as if she may have run off with another man. Good ending too :) | Posted on 2006-03-06 00:00:00 | by Shaqua1973 | [ Reply to This ] | Gee David, I thought this might be a little easier to comment on Russian girls,(I have been oogling that one for 5 days now !) but I realize you just don't write anything that's easy to comment on without just gushing. | I love this. (not too gushy. eh?) I kiked the metaphor of the unfinished book, and how you thread it through your thoughts, your memories and the present place . Past, present and the unpredictable future in one volume, but now at page " twohundredandthirtytwo" , one of the main characters is gone , leaving the other bereft. I liked the repetition of "left" and "She" in those first few lines,— to me it shows the agitation of the poet, It's like when someone close to dies suddenly, and the words "DEAD or GONE FOREVER" haunt you constantly. The conglomeratedwordphrases work for me too in the same way, showing a mind racing,-or is it merely spinning the wheels? The main long strophe where you describe poignant details that you remember creates a powerful and evocative sense of longing and loss. Bittersweet. Passionate. Painful. Tender. hat section is just perfect to me and i wouldn't alter a thing there,-especially these lines "-it made me think there was no place in the world more sacred time standing over us like a voyeur while it should've been busy with other things" I liked the 2 separate lines that lead to the next section; "but there were no other things not then" They show a pause between the trains of thought, a few momentary blanks that seem to me quite appropriate given the emotional state of the poet. And they are heartwrenching in their simplicity and depth. A perfect example of less being more. The next large section sees him musing further as to why she would stop at that particular page,-and the metaphor serves to show some of her possible reasons for abandoning the relationship. Boredom, fear of the future, faded passion or a new love more tantalizing and /or interesting. One line in this section could perhaps use some tweaking—(I just found it cumbersome somehow) " or maybe she was bored with what she had already read" Try something like- "or her interest increasingly lagged and she just couldn't continue" Also in this section I was curious about "Peaked" in "perhaps she peaked ahead ". Did you simply mispell peeked-or was it a play on words? I almost like the wordplay idea, suggesting that she just grew out of the relationship, "peaked" as it were leaving her partner behind on her path. I found this part particularly sad because He really has no idea why she left, and that speaks loudly of a certain isolation or withdrawal long before page 232. Now for the ending, I liked the first line "some of us tend to leave things unfinished" - but the next two are a bit of a letdown. "like me for instance with this poem" The lines do sum up the lost and lonely theme of the poem, but to me the last two seem to abrupt, — like when you can't think of anything else to say in a letter and sign of "Yours truly" I am not sure anything else needs to be said, and though you are conveying the thoughts that the poet might have , I think it could end on more of a fade out. Have it ebb away rather than halt. I liked the title , and the fact that the bookmark was indeed a photo taken in happier times.That was also sad , the photo behind too, but bookmarks serve a purpose, that of reminding us where we left off,-and where to begin again.It is that aspect of meaning that I find interesting here and that you say "bookmarks" as plural. So we have a concrete paper photo (a Kodak moment) inserted a goodly way into a novel, and other abstract markers (memories/thoughts) at the point we call the present in any life. I liked that more subtle yet intriguing thread of your metaphor. Perhaps the concluding lines could bring that bookmarks theme full circle. Just my nickel's worth David. I think this is just a super poem, and now it makes Russian Girls easier to comment on. (But right now I have to find some haiku to comment on because this one critique is to darn long lol and brings my ratio down!) Lovin' it Sally | Posted on 2005-11-26 00:00:00 | by Silverdog | [ Reply to This ] | Hey, I really enjoyed this read. The whole idea is good, but time standing over us like a voyeur... that really gets extra marks. The ending isn't really that great, like if it isn't finished, you should tell what is left unsaid, and if you do then it is finished, and then you should end it more definitely, unless of course it really just was done to start with, and then you should rewrite the ending. Does that make sense? I think your stylising is a little over the top. Saying things without all those spaces and convoluted words would in fact be better in my humble opinion. Good one overall. | | Posted on 2005-11-25 00:00:00 | by Lelik | [ Reply to This ] | I think that maybe she was a little scared about how the book would end, so she quit reading just to keep the sweet moments with her. Maybe she feared that it wouldn't be a happy ending. | And you, maybe you leave the poem unfinished because you don't want to bear the pain of her leaving. Unfinished poems or unfinished books, we all have our reasons, good or bad, its always for a reason. This piece showed a little bit of sadness, love, happiness and maybe a hint of death in it. A collection of emotions that all tie into eachother. I hope that my little interpretation makes sense here, or maybe it is just because I have been gone for so long and have left so many things unfinished myself. Another favorite of mine though, I think. Brightest Blessings, Crystal | Posted on 2005-11-17 00:00:00 | by lenotoire | [ Reply to This ] | i really like this poem, good flow and i could feel the emotion. using she in this part bothered me. | She, pulling at me to get up and dance me telling She white boys got no rhythm it stopped me to go back and read it again instead or continuing. broke the flow at this point for me. even though "her" would be predictable, it flows better to me. your tieing time and voyour together is great. punn | Posted on 2005-11-12 00:00:00 | by punn | [ Reply to This ] | Hey Guy. There are many good things about this poem. There were some clever innovations with the layout of words. The use of the book/story metaphor was good. I felt it was a good read. I felt the best part of the poem was when the emotions flew true | and later a bed or a backseat or a patch of earth so uncompromising that it made me think there was no place in the world more sacred time standing over us like a voyeur while it should've been busy with other things but there were no other things not then I felt the last couple of lines limped home. I guess I was both pleased and disappointed. You set it up for the finale, followed through on your metaphors beautifully and had freash and compelling passages. I just felt that the narrator seemed too indifferent or that his pain/loss was understated and while that works in many instances I see it as a lost opportunity here. She left the rest of the book unread but more importantly while she ran out on their story, he continues to write their story alone. With that in m ind I feel your ending missed the mark. There are good things happening here but I tend to agree with DS in thinking that there's a need for refinement. I'd also look at what you're trying to achieve in one passage and how potently that is balanced against what you have in the next. Just play around with extremes...understatement, truth, different tangeants as far as phrasing and I'm sure you'll be rewarded....perhaps with a poem that is shorter and more uniformly powerful. Food for thought....and just one thought amid a bunch of worthy offerings. Great to see you about guy. DB ![]() | Posted on 2005-11-12 00:00:00 | by Daniel Barlow | [ Reply to This ] | I faved this yesterday with the intention of coming back to it to do a proper comment. | And I'm left with just slack-jawed silent appreciation. You know which bit I like best? Gliding across open floors all spaced out like that... I was honestly gliding in my mind when you wrote that... across wood floors with just socks on lol. I notice how you have a lack of capitalization apart from a few "She's" here and there. It's very effective in giving those few instances a lot of impact. You know I'm really bad with books. I'll start two at one time and read about fifty pages into each before I decide which one to read completely and which one to just go 'meh, boring'. But to get up to page 232 and stop is weird. By that time the whole story is out there and you're wanting to know what happens next... the intro is well over etc etc. This is just beautiful my man. And this is why I stalk you. Coz your words f.ucking rock. Hard. Like big f.ucking rocks from outer space crashing onto my roof to squash me like an insignificant bug. ![]() Peace, ![]() Jase God I wish I could say more, but with faves I just bask and go 'wow you bas.tard, I wish I'd written that'. And there is no better compliment than that in my opinion lol. Great work. | Posted on 2005-11-11 00:00:00 | by alteredlife | [ Reply to This ] | I like the reminiscience and the wondering why she left off on pg 232; why she might have left you. and the people are clear in this poem. we have a sense of her and a sense of you. | I would however, take this out: perhaps she peaked ahead to the last page and didn't like the way it turned out or maybe she was bored with what she had already read or had found a real page-turner that she simply couldn't put down and leave it at: seems a waste to read twohundredandthirtytwo pages and not stick around to find out how it ends some of us tend to leave things unfinished and change the last line: like memories and poems just my two cents! your work needs little revision. | Posted on 2005-11-11 00:00:00 | by sierramuse8 | [ Reply to This ] | first of all let me say that i refuse to read the others comments on this one, because when i get an impression on something so strongly, i just cant be tainted by any others ideas on this. hence my disclaimer: if i repeat anything mucho apologies! | ![]() ok first off i got sucked in rather quickly with this one. the flow was spot on! the tone was kinda wistful in my eyes. i saw a reminicing not as sad, and depressed as it could have been. (which is way refreshing!) a little humor rounded out the middle, with a lovely shift in form. (very characteristic and CLASSIC dnd poetry that i have missed!) the images here are also so vivid, i can see the exact place that He speaks of...nicely done there! with the final part of the piece really driving home the metaphor that you have so cleverly crafted! you give the ending just enough momentum to resonate long after you have finished reading! very well done! -nikki | Posted on 2005-11-11 00:00:00 | by stolie77 | [ Reply to This ] | hey there ol' boy. | i think you have some really nice stuff in here, and especially like the following excerpt: 'that scene is a volume of stories away but i can climb into its mood — jack and coke meets infinite firmaments over bubblewrap carpet and incessant conversation foreverdays and tooshort nights the smell of halston the clandestine glances the taste of virgin lips johnny kemp singing just got paid She, pulling at me to get up and dance me telling She, white boys got no rhythm us finding a rhythm effortlessly g l i d i n g a c r o s s o p e n f l o o r and later a bed or a backseat or a patch of earth so uncompromising that it made me think there was no place in the world more sacred time standing over us like a voyeur while it should've been busy with other things,' i like how breathless it is, i like how it builds and i like the descriptions. it makes me want something to happen in my life. i am happy in my life, but this makes me want to really feel something, even if i am being pulled through sh-it. it makes me want to feel something really fu-cking strong, and i have not for a long while. i do have some little issues of detail that you might want to look at [or not]: 'i found a photo in a book She left — (us two on jodi's couch in the old windowless apartment) a reminder of where She left off left me wondering why She stopped on page twothirtytwo left me wondering why She left me at all [there are a hell of a lot of she's and left's in this little passage. it seems that you must have done it intentionally; i mean you must have done because i would not expect you to overlook this, but to me it reads eversoslightly clumsy. it reads in a very colloquial manner, which is fine because there are other parts of your piece that do too, but it reads like the effort is to repeat it, and i just cant quite get my head around what it adds to your piece other than a slight distraction] that scene is a volume of stories away but i can climb into its mood — jack and coke meets infinite firmaments over bubblewrap carpet and incessant conversation foreverdays and tooshort nights the smell of halston the clandestine glances the taste of virgin lips johnny kemp singing just got paid She, pulling at me to get up and dance me telling She, white boys got no rhythm us finding a rhythm [ i think the repetition of she here is a little careless] effortlessly g l i d i n g a c r o s s o p e n f l o o r [plural? i like the joining of the words in the previous lines but think this is just overdoing it slightly. when you look at your piece as a whole this really stands out all stretched out and i dont think it warrants such importance] and later a bed or a backseat or a patch of earth so uncompromising that it made me think there was no place in the world more sacred time standing over us like a voyeur while it should've been busy with other things but there were no other things not then seems a waste to read twohundredandthirtytwo pages and not stick around to find out how it ends perhaps She peaked ahead to the last page and didn't like the way it turned out or maybe She was bored with what She had already read or had found a real page-turner that She simply couldn't put down [although it is quite clear the concept of She and the capitalisation and such, by the end of the poem i just felt like you had slightly overused it, especially in the line where 'she' is used twice. i can see the importance and such, but you could look at this if you so desired.] some of us tend to like to leave things unfinished [this line is a bit of a gobful and i would suggest taking out 'tend to,'] like me for instance with this poem [i expected something a little more dramatic or finite for your ending. i cant work out if i like it or not but that is irrelevant and whether it works or not, as interesting as it is, might well be down to the reaction of all the readers. i would say this is the strongest write you have produced in a good while, and of course that is only my opinion. but it is not based solely on how much i might like it, but your techniques and descriptions. especially in the middle, your piece is filled with vivid details both central and peripheral, like a lens that pans, with things in the foreground and other things slightly out of focus in the background, take care indeed do why dont you now on1eday | Posted on 2005-11-11 00:00:00 | by on1eday.co.uk | [ Reply to This ] | This is a very strong piece of work. An unfinished book as a metaphor for the end of the relationship is well done here. I sense your loss and your pining for her. Really well done. Hope you heal soon. Excellent work. | Peace, Joe | Posted on 2005-11-11 00:00:00 | by joeyalphabet | [ Reply to This ] | The first time I read this I almost cried. I'm not a "crier" either. Something about the tragedy of losing someone to another...switching books...switching stories...is so heartbreaking. I guess it is to everyone. You've captured it beautifully in this piece though. | I love how you set the scene about finding the photo of you two in a book then comparing every little detail to books and reading and all things about it. I find the descriptions to be vivid and it's as if I'm in the room with you - inside your brain - thinking your thoughts - feeling the sadness of a romance unfinished. I loved the "time standing over us like a voyeur while it should've been busy with other things" line. I'm really glad and grateful to have read this. I have to fav it because I want to read it again and again. *This makes the fourth favorite of the night. I'm really on a roll! hehe* Excellent. Great job. Love the title too. Very fitting. :) -blt | Posted on 2005-11-11 00:00:00 | by borderlinetears | [ Reply to This ] | I'm a bit of a book worm myself so I found myself relating to your poem because of that. When I got to the bit about her leaving the book on page 232, I too wanted to know why! That's a clever thing to put in a poem and I was expecting to find an answer. I love the way you have given a few of your own suggestions, especially the bit about her finding a real page turned and not being able to put him down..that's pure class! But I especially liked the fact that there was no answer to leaving on page 232. It allows the reader to end the poem within themselves. I think the only thing I would change is the last two lines, I would remove them and end the poem with the line 'some of us tend to like to leave things unfinished...' this says enough, no explanation necessary ;-) All in all, a great read. litllost. | | Posted on 2005-11-10 00:00:00 | by litllost | [ Reply to This ] | I kind of like the ending. I guess it's because it reminds me of something I'd write. I also think it's a perfect metaphor. I'm always finding pictures of myself in books I borrow from friends and stuff (I'm waiting to find one in a used bookstore somewhere). I always think they don't look like me, but the firends insist they do, but I digress. | I love the 80's mood in the third stanza. You know it's odd how certain perfumes remind you of certain eras even if they're still produced. I match "retro" perfumes to my retro outfits. "the taste of virgin lips/ johnny kemp singing just got paid" is an interesting juxtapostion. I guess it's the "virgin" and the song about a guy on the prowl with fat pockets. As usual, I like the typographical quirks that you use so well. You're also always good at dragging in sensory details. or maybe She was bored with what she had already read or had found a real page-turner that She simply couldn't put down You know, books always make great metaphors, and that's a great way to suggest that she found another guy. Good work as always, Amy ![]() ![]() | Posted on 2005-11-10 00:00:00 | by cuddledumplin | [ Reply to This ] | Now that was rather cool....Nice to see you writinging again. | It's amazing that something so simple can leave makes us remember things in our past. Like that first love or that first kiss. I don't know but I think it's human nature to leave things unfinished....makes thing more of a mystery. ~shawn | Posted on 2005-11-10 00:00:00 | by armand | [ Reply to This ] | This is a wonderful poem. So very well written and expressed with such a sense of longing and sadness. I got swept up in these words and the story you tell here is amazing. I love the metaphor here. How you can speak of this book, especially in the second to last stanza and question such things that are mere reflections of your thoughts about why she left you. This is really very sad in tone and in the story itself. "Time standing over us like a voyeur" is a great line. So many great lines in this poem. The longing for her is so evident and this is just a wonderful poem. Your opening line in this is fantastic and leads into more depth with every line. There is love and passion and intimacy, sadness, confusion, longing, and yet remains unfinished. What a great end to this write. I could go on and on with things I admire in this. This is obviously a most personal poem to you. Your thoughts are so very well expressed. This is most definitely favorite material yet somehow seems too personal to take to my page. I will just say this...Excellent! | Lorna ![]() | Posted on 2005-11-10 00:00:00 | by lmz | [ Reply to This ] | Oh, no. It's a complete poem. In fact, I'd say you need to 86 that last line and write a new one in it's stead. | I can't go over this and point here or there and say anything constructive, but I can tell you what moved me the most. For me these were the most meaningful, fresh and exciting lines: time standing over us like a voyeur while it should've been busy with other things but there were no other things not then Right, not ever. Good to read something new by you, Dave | Posted on 2005-11-10 00:00:00 | by Sandburg | [ Reply to This ] | |